Licence to Stream? How Amazon Changes James Bond with Hendo (and the new Bond Theme Song!)

David Brown: 00:00:00

My position on it, and I mean, we can get into this, but my position on it is that basically, fuck Amazon. There's just something that really annoys me about big companies who buy someone else's IP and then have no sort of skin in the game.

David Brown: 00:00:29

The only reason they're doing it is because it's content, which is why the.

Angus Henderson: 00:00:34

I hate that word.

David Brown: 00:00:35

I know. Which is. Which is why Barbara Broccoli

Angus Henderson: 00:00:40

Cubby's son. Cubby's daughter.

David Brown: 00:00:41

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:00:41

Call it Cubby's son.

David Brown: 00:00:43

And that's why she hated Amazon because they had a meeting about it and one of the people at Amazon called it content. And basically she was like, no. And so she basically was like, no, I'm not having anything to do with Amazon, and hated them.

And then apparently something else happened later and they actually basically doubled down on that. And so she was like, I'm never working with Amazon ever right now. Nobody seems to know what happened to make her change her mind.

But, you know, maybe was it a billion dollars or something? Ridiculous. And they still have some sort of residual income, you know, agreement that goes with that as well.

So maybe that's, there's some sort of rev share something that's going to come out of it.

Angus Henderson: 00:01:31

But I mean, yeah, the sums of money involved are huge and eye watering. But she's definitely been offered a lot of money, I would have thought. I mean, I, I've got, I mean, I sort of, I know people who know the broccoli.

This is really weird. Right.

So, yeah, I, I, I used to, I did a training course under a first ad, first assistant director, who was the son of a first assistant director and both generations of that family. I mean, you can look at, I'm not going to say his name, but you can look him up. You should get him on here. Worked on the Bond franchise.

So his, his father was the first AD across the entire Bond franchise.

David Brown: 00:02:11

Right.

Angus Henderson: 00:02:12

And then his son took over the mantle.

David Brown: 00:02:14

Right.

Angus Henderson: 00:02:15

And, and made some of the films. I'd really love to know what he thinks.

David Brown: 00:02:20

If anyone's curious, they can go look it up.

Angus Henderson: 00:02:22

Yeah, Google, we'll make them do a.

David Brown: 00:02:24

Little, we'll make them do a little bit of work to find out.

Angus Henderson: 00:02:29

And he's a lovely man. He's got some great anecdotes, got some great stories about it.

I wonder, I wonder what he would think, because obviously the Broccoli family and Ian Fleming, it's a small group of individuals that have had power over who this character is, you know, his Britishness, which is Almost. You know, I thought I was the most British person on planet Earth.

But no, if you cut James Bond in half, his organs, have a little Union Jack stamped on each one, on his kidneys. As a little Union Jack.

David Brown: 00:03:02

Exactly, exactly.

Angus Henderson: 00:03:05

You know, so to open that up to the Amazon world is a little scary. You kind of have to trust that they do the right thing. They do a lot of. They do a lot of.

They use algorithms to look at data viewers, data, what people want to see, what people want to watch, and to make commissioning decisions.

David Brown: 00:03:28

But isn't that the problem these days? And this is the bigger discussion that I think we also should have, because there are other examples. There's like, Star Wars.

And I was listening to another podcast, a podcast called the Town, and it's hosted by Matt Baloney. And. And he had this guy, Luca Shaw, who's from. From Bloom.

Angus Henderson: 00:03:48

Baloney.

David Brown: 00:03:49

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:03:49

I love it.

David Brown: 00:03:50

And. And they were talking about the fact, you know, you can look at Disney buying the Lucas IP and what they did with Star wars.

And they had a really interesting point, which was that at the time, Lucas wasn't doing very well with Star wars himself. Right. Because they came out with the prequels that, you know, weren't. That was, you know, that. That weren't doing fantastic anyway.

And then, of course, Disney got involved. And I don't remember, was Jar Jar Binks, was that the Disney or was that Lucas? I can't remember.

Angus Henderson: 00:04:21

Horrible character.

David Brown: 00:04:23

I know, but. But their point was, is, you know, kind of Disney came in and it's been hit and miss since then. Like the Mandalorian. Really, really good.

I think everybody liked the Mandalorian. I think Rogue One, it's probably the best Star wars film there is.

Angus Henderson: 00:04:39

Rogue One is absolutely brilliant.

David Brown: 00:04:41

Out of all of them, I think it's the best.

Angus Henderson: 00:04:43

One of my mates is in that film. In fact, another friend is in the Star wars franchise. I'm not going to mention him. He's an actor. Roger. Well, I mentioned him. Roger Barkley.

Look him up. It's got one of those peaked caps on the Death Star, you know.

David Brown: 00:04:55

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:04:56

And he looks right for the role. Another friend of mine is an extra, Was an extra in Rogue One, and then he had a little plastic figure made of him.

So he's got a plastic figure of himself.

David Brown: 00:05:07

That's so cool.

Angus Henderson: 00:05:08

She obviously went out and bought, like, 20 of them.

David Brown: 00:05:10

Of course. Yeah, he bought them all.

Angus Henderson: 00:05:13

Yeah, yeah, he bought. He bought all 20.

David Brown: 00:05:16

Make sure they keep making them.

Angus Henderson: 00:05:17

Yeah, exactly. Really, really popular. They can't work out why that one figure is so popular.

David Brown: 00:05:23

Exactly.

Angus Henderson: 00:05:23

Flying off the. Flying off the shelves. There's one guy in Australia buying them all.

David Brown: 00:05:28

Yeah, mad. Yeah, but you know what I mean, like it's.

But I think overall it's what happens in my mind that I think that the challenge to it is what happens and particularly with Bond, because Bond is such a British brand and it's so tied to the identity of the UK and it actually does better outside of the us. The US and Canadian markets. It actually does way better outside the U.S. than it does inside the U.S.

and so I think a lot of people's fear is that not only are they going to do cheesy shit with it, like they're going to make TV shows and EM's going to have her, you know, her own show's definitely going.

Angus Henderson: 00:06:12

To have her own show.

David Brown: 00:06:12

Moneypenny is going to have her own.

Angus Henderson: 00:06:13

Show, 687.

David Brown: 00:06:17

And they're going to put some random, probably non British actor in the role which is just going to. That would be. That would be the worst fear. Like that's kind of worst case scenario. And I think.

Angus Henderson: 00:06:30

Square jawed Texan.

David Brown: 00:06:32

Exactly. Because they view it as content. It's just another piece of content that they can try and, you know, do something.

Angus Henderson: 00:06:39

I mean, that would. I mean they would. Surely they're not that stupid though. I mean, surely they wouldn't do that.

I mean surely, surely they'd put someone like Henry Cavill in. You know what I mean? He's British, isn't he? Cavill?

David Brown: 00:06:52

I think so, yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:06:53

Yeah, he would be good. He would be.

David Brown: 00:06:55

Well, he's been the one that everybody's talked about for ages, but I still.

Angus Henderson: 00:06:58

See Henry in that. But you know, maybe he's off making. The rumor is he's off making Warhammer 40,000 films, but I don't know if that's true.

David Brown: 00:07:06

Yeah, he is. Yeah. Well, yeah, that's been fairly widely covered, I think.

Angus Henderson: 00:07:10

But buy their shares now. It's going to be a massive platform for them. It might already be priced in, but I mean there's not going to just be one Warhammer film, is it?

There's going to be a whole universe opening up there. Buy their shares now.

David Brown: 00:07:25

And the other thing with him is he's a huge Warhammer geek himself and so that also just taps in. I mean he's a geek for all the stuff that he's in. Do you know what I mean? He was a geek for the Witcher. Loved the Witcher.

He knew more about the Witcher lore than Anyone else in the Witcher.

Angus Henderson: 00:07:42

And I've read those books and they're not bad books, they're a bit repetitive. But yeah, no, no, he is a geek in non geeks clothing, isn't he?

David Brown: 00:07:52

Yeah, and that's.

And he taps in directly to those audiences, I think, and it brings those audiences along in a way that, you know, probably wouldn't be in any other franchise. And he could do that for Bond as well, I reckon.

But there was, I guess the articles I've read was that the feeling was, is that he was too old and that they wanted to go back to do a, a younger Bond.

Angus Henderson: 00:08:16

For years I have heard rumors that they want younger Bonds so they can get four or five films out of him. And if you, you know, I mean, Daniel Craig. How old was Daniel Craig when he started the franchise? He would have been a lot younger than.

David Brown: 00:08:32

That's a good question.

Angus Henderson: 00:08:33

Roger Moore and Sean Connery. Because Roger Moore and Sean Connery basically aged out, which is why they want to have someone who has a really good run.

But Daniel Craig I don't think was particularly young when he joined.

David Brown: 00:08:46

38.

Angus Henderson: 00:08:47

38. I mean they're probably looking at somebody early 30s, late 20s even. I mean they could do a young Bond. Who knows, who knows what they're going to do?

David Brown: 00:08:59

I, I doubt Roger Moore was 45. Yeah, he was quite old.

Angus Henderson: 00:09:07

Roger was Roger. I mean, Roger did what Roger did.

David Brown: 00:09:10

Exactly.

Angus Henderson: 00:09:11

Made the role his own.

David Brown: 00:09:12

You gotta love the Internet. So Sean Connery was 32, Lazenby was 29, Moore was 45, Timothy Dalton was 41.

Angus Henderson: 00:09:24

We don't talk about him because he made a quiche in one of the scenes. We don't mention Timothy Dalton. Bond doesn't quiche. Bond eats steak eggs.

David Brown: 00:09:32

Exactly.

Angus Henderson: 00:09:34

And champagne. That's it.

David Brown: 00:09:35

Champagne and martinis.

Angus Henderson: 00:09:37

Martinis.

David Brown: 00:09:40

Yeah. Pierce Brosnan was 42 and Daniel Craig was 38.

Angus Henderson: 00:09:43

Well, I think Pierce Brosnan did a good job. Yeah, but they are, they will look for young. But an actor has to have, for, for a film to sell.

The actor has to have a decent number of films behind him to bring viewers to it.

I mean, Bond's always going to have viewers because there's a, you know, it's the longest running, most successful franchise the UK has ever produced. You know, we love a sequel. Studios love a sequel because they have an audience already. That's why you get. What's that ridiculous car film?

Fast and Furious 136 is coming out next year.

David Brown: 00:10:19

Exactly.

Angus Henderson: 00:10:20

Yeah. And guess what?

It'll have an audience and People will go and watch it, but they have to find new and interesting ways to blow up cars, send them through buildings and through helicopters and things. Whereas Bond has got everything there. You know, Bond has so many tropes.

David Brown: 00:10:37

Yeah, yeah. And Henry Cavill's 41. Sorry, I was looking up how old he is. So Henry Cavill's 41, so he's prime.

He's well within the age range to do a few films if they wanted to.

Angus Henderson: 00:10:50

Yeah, but.

David Brown: 00:10:52

Yeah, I don't know.

Angus Henderson: 00:10:56

You're scared that they're going to ruin it, right?

David Brown: 00:10:58

Yeah, I'm scared they're going to ruin it and I'm scared.

Angus Henderson: 00:11:01

Was Rogue One. I mean, Rogue One came out Star wars with Disney, didn't it? That was a good film.

So I think it very much depends who the producer is, who the director is, who the stars are. Is it a good script, how much money they spend on it? They could ruin it. Some of it could be terrible. Yeah, but, but, but what?

What I find sort of deeply confusing about the whole thing is James Bond. It's a massive spoiler. If you haven't seen the last film. He's dead. He died in the last film. So where do you then go from that?

Did he not die in the last film?

David Brown: 00:11:34

But it's that Bond, that Bond. Right.

Angus Henderson: 00:11:38

So the new character is what?

David Brown: 00:11:40

Because every film Bond stone away and.

Angus Henderson: 00:11:43

Come out of a cave. Oh, James Bond's still alive. Look at me. Big Jesus arms. I mean, what happened?

David Brown: 00:11:48

But it's the.

Angus Henderson: 00:11:49

He's dead. Why would you kill your main character? You know where they shot that, they've put a gravestone to James Bond. Yeah. It's become a tourist site.

You can go and visit James Bond's gravestone.

David Brown: 00:12:03

Right.

Angus Henderson: 00:12:04

So I think it's quite a cool idea. I don't know whether it's New Zealand or Australia. Somewhere like that.

David Brown: 00:12:08

Right. Yeah. Interesting. I don't know. See, I think, look, it's a film.

Angus Henderson: 00:12:18

You're worried that might be a little bit of wokeness creeping into the bottom franchise. Is that what you want? What concerns.

David Brown: 00:12:24

No, that doesn't. That doesn't concern me at all. I think. I think there's a concept of James Bond and I know, you know, obviously there's a.

There's a fixed character in the books and this is based off the books and we've built this.

Angus Henderson: 00:12:37

We run out of books, haven't we? We ran out of books a long.

David Brown: 00:12:40

Time ago, but that's why I think you've got to go back earlier. So then what you do is you're like, if you're going to keep James Bond as the James Bond character, then you go back to.

And this is what I suspect they might have been thinking, because that's the only place to go now. Right. You can't go any older because the James Bond as James Bond is dead.

Angus Henderson: 00:13:01

you mean? Like set it in the: 1960

David Brown: 00:13:06

Yeah. So you've got like a 20 year old bond.

Angus Henderson: 00:13:08

Right, right.

David Brown: 00:13:09

So it's that story. Maybe it's the story of him just becoming Bond or how did he become Bond?

Angus Henderson: 00:13:16

Why is him becoming Bond is in Casino Royale, the existing film.

David Brown: 00:13:20

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:13:20

Not the old Casino Royale, the new.

David Brown: 00:13:22

Casino Royale, the new one.

Angus Henderson: 00:13:24

He's driving a Ford higher car. You know, he doesn't really know what he's doing.

David Brown: 00:13:28

Yeah, yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:13:29

He's not really James Bond yet. So that kind of story has been told already. I think you just have to weave in some missions that are in between all the other missions.

I think if the audience can handle his face changing every few years.

David Brown: 00:13:42

Well, exactly.

Angus Henderson: 00:13:43

They could probably handle, you know, him becoming a bit younger or doing, doing something else.

David Brown: 00:13:50

But yeah, I, I, yeah, it's, it's not even, it's not even that. I think it's just this, this is.

Angus Henderson: 00:13:59

Wrong, by the way. This is wrong. We should be drinking vodka martinis. We should have a bottle of Merlot. We should have.

David Brown: 00:14:06

This is, I don't know, I don't know.

Angus Henderson: 00:14:08

How do we do this mug?

David Brown: 00:14:09

I don't know what's in that mug.

Angus Henderson: 00:14:10

I promise you it's coffee. Maybe it's an espresso martini that I've just put in a little bit of vodka in the bo.

David Brown: 00:14:17

That's the joy of a mug, is that you can put anything in it you want.

Angus Henderson: 00:14:23

All of your viewers are wondering what's in that mug now. Is he drinking vodka?

David Brown: 00:14:28

I borrowed the cup from Costa, so.

Angus Henderson: 00:14:32

I thought they were. I thought you were sponsored by Costa. I thought that was what was going on.

David Brown: 00:14:35

I should be. Yeah, Costa, if you're listening, sponsor, Sponsor. I'll use it every time he drinks.

Angus Henderson: 00:14:41

Vodka out of your cups.

David Brown: 00:14:46

Yeah. And these other guys were also talking about like the difference between. So you've.

The other major franchise kind of that you could talk about, I guess is Harry Potter, where the studio kind of still owns all the ip, but she still has say over what happens with the characters directly.

Angus Henderson: 00:15:09

Sure.

David Brown: 00:15:09

So she has kind of veto power, but they still own the rights to all the films and they can kind of go and kind of do what they want, but she still has some input into it and yeah, I don't, I don't know, I just, I don't.

Angus Henderson: 00:15:25

Know if I want to see so many people invested in the franchise.

David Brown: 00:15:28

I just don't know if I want to see a Bond TV show sponsored by Aston Martin. It won't be. That's the problem.

Angus Henderson: 00:15:36

Well, a Bond TV show would be appalling. It would make me feel a bit sad. It needs to be a grand event that gets people to the cinema. It needs to be a bit red carpet.

I was very lucky because when I went to the Baftas with one of our films, it was the 75 year anniversary of Bond and the very first thing that happened was Shirley Bassey walked out on stage, which we didn't know was going to happen, and sang Diamonds Are Forever in front of a live, a full live orchestra. I mean that you just can't, money just can't buy that. It was incredible. And the Bond came with there and that was extraordinary.

So there is a magic, A lot of the magic comes from the music. The music.

David Brown: 00:16:19

So I think the next, this next Bond film will probably be the single most, or if maybe not the second most important Bond film in the whole.

Angus Henderson: 00:16:30

Everybody's going to be wondering in the whole thing.

David Brown: 00:16:34

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:16:34

Are they going to mess it up? So much pressure. Can you imagine the pressure?

David Brown: 00:16:38

Yeah, they've, they've got to pick a good British actor. They've got to have a, I think they need to have a British director now though they may choose one of the directors that.

Angus Henderson: 00:16:49

Don't worry old boy, they want the 40% UK film tax credit on that bad boy. Guess what that is on tens of millions of pounds.

David Brown: 00:16:57

Yeah, exactly.

So, yeah, so I, I think that they, particularly with all the press and all the, all the chatter that's been happening about, I mean where talking about it and you know, we're a small independent podcast so like everyone in the world is talking about this. It's been on. The rest is entertainment like yeah, tons and tons of shows.

I've, ever since I mentioned this the other day to, to some of the people in my network, I've had people sending me links to podcasts and stories and articles and TV segments and all sorts of stuff covering it and yeah, I, I, I, in a way I kind of don't envy the, the person who has to pick it up, the.

Angus Henderson: 00:17:37

Producer, the director and the actor who's stepping into Bond's shoes. Oh my God. The anxiety on that set, Barbara will just keep popping in and going, oh, really? You know, the head of Amazon will be.

Sure the director will be like, oh, get these people off my shoulders, you know?

David Brown: 00:17:54

Or do you think she'll just completely just wash her hands?

Angus Henderson: 00:17:57

She can't. They can't wash their hands of it, man. It's part of their DNA. It's a family business.

David Brown: 00:18:02

It's. You know, maybe that's.

Angus Henderson: 00:18:04

I mean, do you know that this is. A couple of anecdotes from the.

From the Bond world have been mentioned to me over the years, because I've known quite a lot of crew that worked on it in some shape or form. You know, the Bond crew, I think it must have been in the Pierce Brosnan era, because there was an ice driving scene and they wanted.

They said to Aston Martin, hey, can we take one of your Astons? We want to. Can you, Aston Martin? Can you raise it up so it's a 4x4 and put spikes through the wheels so that we could drive it around on ice?

And Aston Martin said, no. Get this, guys. Guess what they want to do to one of our ancestors. Can't do that. Laugh them out the room. The Bond crew did it themselves.

David Brown: 00:18:54

Yeah, right.

Angus Henderson: 00:18:55

So there's a family of very talented. Yes, we can guys that work on those movies. I mean, crew are always, yes, we can, rather than no, we can't. Yes, we can.

Let's think about that for a while. We'll find a solution. So that's just one of the little geniuses of Bond, is that they will do things. They will make things happen.

The other story that I've heard, which gives you some idea of the power of the franchise to sell things, to sell Omega watches or aston Martins or BMWs or Canali suits or wherever it is they're selling. There's a rumor that Barbara had a boyfriend. And this boyfriend and Barbara were invited to the Aston Martin showroom or factory.

And there were 11 beautiful new Aston Martin models laid out in front of them and various different colors. And she turned and said to her boyfriend, which one would you like?

And Aston Martin were just giving them cars for free, you know, and that Aston Martin itself is not a company that is hugely financially stable. I think they've had wobbles all over the years, various shapes and forms of, you know, from going completely bankrupt to, oh, no, we're okay.

Actually, someone's bailed us out. So what is certainly going to happen is that Amazon are going to realize the power of product placement in a Bond film. Which is enormous.

I mean, there was one Pierce Brosnan movie where he came. There's a huge. There was a huge advert for an Omega Seamaster at the beginning, before the film rolled at the cinema.

And the very first scene, or very, very early in the movie, he's clearing out a dam of baddies. Let's say they're Russians. They're probably Russians. They're going to be Russians again after all this stuff going on in Ukraine, let's face it.

In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Bond is running around Ukraine in the next film. Let's see, let's see.

David Brown: 00:21:02

That'll be part of the deal.

Angus Henderson: 00:21:04

So Pierce Brosnan's there, and the very first shot you see is him coming around the corner with his Walter ppk. And what is that? What is that in shot on his wrist? I mean, it's almost like, let's glue it. Let's glue it to his wrist so that the gun. We can sell.

Lots of Walter PPKs and we can sell to Americans, obviously.

David Brown: 00:21:25

That's right.

Angus Henderson: 00:21:25

And because we don't buy them over here, because we've got sensible gun laws and lots of Omega Seamasters.

David Brown: 00:21:32

Yeah, yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:21:33

Oh, and black ties and everything else, you know, whatever, Aston Martins, whatever. So that's something that's going to happen. Amazon is going to go, hold on a minute.

We can make more money from the product placement than we can from the films.

David Brown: 00:21:45

From the film.

Angus Henderson: 00:21:46

Yeah, from the films.

David Brown: 00:21:47

Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, from that perspective, I get it. And I also get it from the.

I also get it from the creator perspective, because, again, you look at something like Lucas or you look at something like this, and the family who's had creative control and, you know, however they got it from the beginning. But that family's been, you know, working on that IP for decades, 70 years. And at some point, you know, I think a lot of people forget that.

Yes, musicians and performers and creatives, they love to create and filmmakers want to make films and actors want to act, but everybody's got to eat as well. And it's a job and it's what you do for a living. And so you do need to monetize that stuff.

And, you know, yes, you want people to love what you make, but you want them to love what you make and pay you for it so that. So that you can make money.

Angus Henderson: 00:22:45

Oh, yeah, we could just. Yeah, let's just. I bond and I Bond. Can walk around the corner. Yeah, fuck it.

David Brown: 00:22:50

Yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:22:55

You know, a friend says me, the Other day. Hold that thought because we're going to come back to that. This is really interesting, Francis. Today.

They're never going to make actors out of AI And I said, why? He said, well, an act, an AI actor can't walk down the red carpet. He can't promote your products, he can't shake your hand, you can't sleep with him.

You know, you can't become the love interest of millions of women or the other way around. A female actress can't become the love interests of millions of men.

David Brown: 00:23:22

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:23:22

You can't wear your. She can't wear your dress to the premiere. So there are, you know, some things that won't change that will say the same.

David Brown: 00:23:33

I. Yeah, 100%.

Angus Henderson: 00:23:35

Let's go back to your original thought because I've just been there.

David Brown: 00:23:38

No, no, no, that's fine. That's. Look, we can chat about whatever, whatever we want to talk about. It's fine. And it's interesting.

I think this is, this is a bigger conversation obviously about what's happening in film. And I, you know, can. Can come into that as well, I think where it's interesting and certainly what I've seen happening already.

And I don't know if this is anything that you've seen personally yet, but I've seen some articles and I've heard some people talking about the fact that, like now they don't even need to do really callbacks anymore, because if they have stuff that they need to reshoot or whatever, they just use AI to do it. If it's small, if it's something that's major, then yes, they will still get the actors back in.

But if it's something small that they need to fix, they can literally just AI to do it. And it. No one would even notice. And it's just another part of this, the suite of sort of FX they have that they can use.

Angus Henderson: 00:24:31

Yeah.

David Brown: 00:24:31

Now.

Angus Henderson: 00:24:32

And they're not getting an entire. Not paying the actor to do it.

David Brown: 00:24:35

Yeah, exactly. And it's, it's all the crew. It's apparently the, the new contracts that they have, you know, the, the capacity to do that and the ability to do that.

Where I wonder, though, is I think the big feature films will still.

For exactly those reasons that you just outlined, having the human and the interaction and all those things that kind of drive people and make celebrities. Celebrities will still continue where I think we're going to see it, and we're already seeing it is on. Well, look, you have your own film company.

I've got a small media company.

We've both got hundreds of friends who are freelancers and do stuff and this used to be a way that, that you could make a living by picking up small bits of work here and there. And you know, you could, it was a way you could, you could get by.

e sort of everyday, you know,: 1500

And is it the same quality? No, no, but is it good enough for them?

Angus Henderson: 00:26:06

Is it good enough for them? I mean, that's the question. Is it good enough for you? I mean, that's a conversation you can have with clients quite a lot.

the industry in troves since: 2019

I mean, AI is uncharted territory. The government, you know, who's retraining people to deal with it, to use it. Nobody, unless you can pay for it, you know.

David Brown: 00:27:00

And a lot of, and a lot of courses have popped up and some of them are by people who are very good and know what they're talking about.

Angus Henderson: 00:27:07

The Bond theme tune. Be somebody saying to AI, make me some James Bond sounding music for our next Amazon film. Or will it be a composer?

David Brown: 00:27:25

I'll do that.

Angus Henderson: 00:27:26

That's an interesting question.

David Brown: 00:27:27

I'll do that and I'll shove some of the music in right now, make.

Angus Henderson: 00:27:31

It with AI and put it into this edit when we put it out. That's gonna, that's gonna be amazing.

David Brown: 00:27:37

Yeah, yeah.

Bond Theme Song: 00:27:44

When the night falls cold and the silent screams A world of secrets Tears at the seams through the smoke and flame I walk alone A fractured heart Carved out of stone the clock is ticking the end is near A whispered promise Drowned in fear But I'll rise again where the ashes lay for the game I play Won't fade away on.

Bond Theme Song: 00:28:15

The edge of shadows I stand and fight A ghost in the darkness Stealing the night when the skies turn red and the truth unwinds.

Angus Henderson: 00:28:26

Oh, that sounds good. Spooky. Yeah.

David Brown: 00:28:29

That's amazing.

Angus Henderson: 00:28:30

Can't believe we're sitting in a Bond film. By the way, the Amazon, the franchise with Bond has already expanded. I don't know if you ever saw Road to a Million.

Was it called Road to a Million, which was a game show with.

Where couples from around the world had to do James Bond, like stuff like jumping on top of a train and going through the train and finding a clue and then finding a briefcase with a timer in it. Did you see that? I mean, that had the lead role from Succession, the Scottish actor playing, you.

David Brown: 00:29:13

Know what a James Font style villain. I've never seen Succession.

Angus Henderson: 00:29:18

Sorry, David, I'm gonna have to leave. Gonna have to leave. Only. Only the best.

And I think of it as a dark comedy because there's moments in Succession which are absolutely hilarious, but it's not. Probably only one of the best TV series that's been on television in the last three or four years.

David Brown: 00:29:40

I have a personal habit.

Angus Henderson: 00:29:41

I'm outraged. I can't. I'm not.

David Brown: 00:29:43

We can't be friends.

Angus Henderson: 00:29:44

We can't be friends anymore. Cannot be friends anymore. Anyway, my original point was there has been an expansion of the Bond franchise already because that's what they did.

They made it. They made a very good show that had the atmosphere of Bond and the challenge of Bond, but it involved everyday people.

I don't know if it got recommissioned. I'm not entirely sure, but it was good. I've forgotten that. I've also forgotten the name of the lead actor in Succession.

David Brown: 00:30:11

Well, I know I've. I've got a. I'd heard some other people talk about this and you know, Amazon's already done a Bond type film before which was called Citadel.

And what's been really interesting about that is there's two wildly different views.

Angus Henderson: 00:30:30

Citadel.

David Brown: 00:30:31

Yeah. Of that.

Angus Henderson: 00:30:33

So hold on, hold on. It was a spy movie or it was a Bond.

David Brown: 00:30:39

No, it was a spy movie, but it was their attempt at making apparently a Bond esque. The. I've got an article from the Telegraph here because I heard the guys talking about it last night.

Angus Henderson: 00:30:50

I mean, I haven't even heard of Citadel and I'm in the film industry, which is important.

David Brown: 00:30:55

It says Citadel was Jeff Bezos. Yeah, it Says Citadel was Jeff Bezos's globe trotting gadget laden attempt at a Marvel universe for spies. And it does not bode well for Bond fans.

Hey, you know, that's from the Tory graph.

Angus Henderson: 00:31:15

That's a bit worrying. You've just reminded me that I worked with Roger Moore's son the other day on a spy movie where he plays a spy and it's called Nightfall.

I think it's coming out later this year. What a lovely man.

So Roger Moore's son Jeffrey, he's got two sons and a daughter, also produced the documentary about his father Roger, which came out on the BBC, I think was BBC earlier this year or, or late last year. And Jeffrey has all of his father's mannerisms. He's very, very lovely man. He's very tall. He's obviously an older guy now.

And I think a producer friend of mine asked, asked Jeffrey if he wanted to play a kind of spy catcher coming out of retirement. When I think there's a home invasion, there's a home invasion. Right. His house, his daughter's involved and. Yeah. So randomly.

So I managed to get some investors into that film and I said, you want to play. I want to play extras in the movie. And they were like, yeah, let's play again. Let's do it. Let's play most.

I mean, they're in tech and I think the other guy's a lawyer. And I said, you want to come and be extras? And they were like, yes, yes. So they played mercenary.

So he got onto the roof of the Second World War army base. She had all these satellite dishes on.

David Brown: 00:32:34

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:32:35

This is a night shoot. About 2 in the morning, Jeffrey Moore showed up and killed them.

David Brown: 00:32:42

If you, if you, if you send me some high res on WhatsApp of those, I will put them in over the top so people can see them if you want.

Angus Henderson: 00:32:51

Yeah, yeah, why not, why not?

David Brown: 00:32:52

I can just drop.

Angus Henderson: 00:32:53

I mean, we don't, we didn't have. It will be fairly obvious that we didn't have a James Bond budget when we made it. But it's a good romp of a film. It's good fun, you know.

David Brown: 00:33:03

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:33:03

It does all the things that a spy movie should.

David Brown: 00:33:06

I wonder what he would think of it.

Angus Henderson: 00:33:07

It's got Ian Ogleby in it as well from the Saint. So, you know, it's a bit going on there. Something a bit chewy for the fans, you know.

David Brown: 00:33:15

Yeah, yeah, yeah, Interesting. So if you had to, if you had to put your money on it on the Bond thing with Amazon, what do you, what do you think will happen?

Angus Henderson: 00:33:29

Well, this is what, it's a business, right?

So I mean, the whole industry is a business and businesses are designed to make as much money as possible, squeeze every little cent they can out of the Bond franchise. So there's going to be all kinds of things going on. There will be films, I'm sure there will be a film.

There'll probably be films about other characters, as we've mentioned. The whole universe will probably expand. There will probably be a TV show in one shape or form. There might be an animated series. I suspect there will.

I don't know if you've seen Archer baby Bond. Have you seen Archer the Animated Series?

David Brown: 00:34:06

I know, I know.

Angus Henderson: 00:34:07

Grown ups not for children. Yeah, it's bloody brilliant. I mean it's, it's hilarious, but it's basically James Bond. But it's the worst aspects of him.

You know, he's completely gin soaked and loving it. So there will be something like that. I'm sure there will be. I, I just.

Going back to the amount of pressure there's going to be on that first film, I mean, it will be unbelievable.

And almost anything they do now in the press from this point onwards, even if they say, oh, it's in trouble, oh, it's very troubled, it's going to be very difficult. They wanted this actor, they couldn't get him anything. They did. If I was that PR office, I would be putting out a story a week and just hammering it.

It doesn't matter if even the bad news that they put out now, people are going to go and see that film. The good news, people are going to go and see that film. Anything they say, you know.

David Brown: 00:35:06

Yeah, that's true. Yeah. Everyone's going to be curious and everything.

Angus Henderson: 00:35:10

Will be publicity like. So who's got the watch?

David Brown: 00:35:13

And are they going to put it in theaters? Yeah. Are they going to put it in theaters or they're just going to put it straight to Amazon Prime?

Angus Henderson: 00:35:19

Oh, gosh, that is a question.

David Brown: 00:35:21

I mean, I mean, what's the feeling like within the film industry about cinema versus say Netflix or Amazon prime or any of the online streaming things? Is there, what's the internal industry feeling about that?

Is it the way forward or is everybody still sort of really want to hold out for people going to theaters?

Angus Henderson: 00:35:43

The UK is not a very good example. Cinemas. There are way, way more cinemas in other countries. Yeah. China, India. The cinema is still a huge event. It's a, it's a night out.

It's not as expensive as it is here in the uk.

David Brown: 00:36:02

Ridiculous.

Angus Henderson: 00:36:03

A lot of our cinemas, if you look at our cinemas, if you look at Leicester Square, this is prime London real estate. So the real estate guys are looking at every square meter of that, thinking 6 grand a square meter, 8 grand, 10 grand, 20 grand.

You know, there's probably more money in ripping them down and turning them into luxury condos than there is having them as a cinema. Cinemas have for years in the UK made more money from popcorn and snacks than they have from the ticket price. So I hear.

I mean, you know, don't quote me on that, but cinemas and the rest of planet Earth are still very popular. The UK is a bit weird.

Does streaming the film on the same day as you put it in the cinema, does that killing cinema a bit more than, than it has died over the years?

David Brown: 00:36:59

Maybe.

Angus Henderson: 00:37:00

Possibly. I think it probably is. But I'm not one of those guys who pays £13 to watch it in his own. In my own house.

David Brown: 00:37:07

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:37:08

You know, I don't have the 45 inch TV and you know, all of this kind of stuff. So I'd much rather go and see if there are certain films I will only see in the cinema. The new Alien movie that came out recently. June.

Watching Dune at home on a laptop.

David Brown: 00:37:23

No.

Angus Henderson: 00:37:24

Or, or, or, or a phone. I'm not going to do that. James Bond. I am not going to watch a home. I'm going to watch that at cinema. And I think many people will be the same.

There are some films, the second Top Gun film. I'm not watching that at home. These are events, these are cinematic events. Right.

David Brown: 00:37:45

So I want to, I want to get you back on another time. And this isn't for today because I think this is. Warrants its own.

Angus Henderson: 00:37:51

I haven't got the check from today yet, David.

David Brown: 00:37:54

I know exactly my extraordinarily large bill. You know what's in the glass?

Angus Henderson: 00:38:01

Yeah, it's in a. My, my, my fee is in the p. In a pint glass, by the way.

David Brown: 00:38:06

Exactly. Yeah. I'll sort you out. That work?

Angus Henderson: 00:38:08

It's not even the black one with white bit at the top.

David Brown: 00:38:10

It's just the cheaper stuff I want to talk about.

Angus Henderson: 00:38:16

It's going to be a winner.

David Brown: 00:38:18

The infinite sort of this whole thing like Marvel comes to mind with.

I think they said they had 30 films or something planned out and Disney was like, yeah, we've got the next 30 films planned out over the next 10 years or whatever. And it's like, oh my God, it's like Death by Marvel.

And no one's going to the cinema anymore because it's just rehashing the same old shit, and it doesn't feel like there's anything new.

Angus Henderson: 00:38:49

Iron man was the guy. I mean, why would you kill Iron Man? What a stupid thing to do.

David Brown: 00:38:53

I know, but it's.

Angus Henderson: 00:38:54

Iron man was the dude. Iron man was what people went to see. Everyone else was great, but they weren't Iron man, you know?

David Brown: 00:39:00

Yeah, exactly. So you know what I mean, though? But it's just this, like, this infinite stream. And again, Bond did it, but it did it in a different.

Like, it never kind of felt tired and old. And then when it did, it was because you got tired of that actor. And then they bring a new actor in that would kind of refresh the whole thing.

The Daniel Craig bit was his Bond, and his portrayal of Bond was very different.

Angus Henderson: 00:39:26

Well, he was an. He was basically. To me, he was an SAS guy, basically. I mean, that was the time, you know, when these SAS guys were starting to come into the.

Into the press and stuff, and that's where he was. He was a big slab of meat.

David Brown: 00:39:40

Well, they had competition from. What's the Matt Damon one?

Angus Henderson: 00:39:45

Matt Damon, Yeah. Well, you're talking about Bourne.

David Brown: 00:39:49

Bourne Born.

Angus Henderson: 00:39:50

The first film's brilliant. Matt not in it.

David Brown: 00:39:52

Yeah. I mean, we're gonna end up doing a review, a film review.

Angus Henderson: 00:40:00

Every single film, by the way. I know, I. I know I've said this before.

Well, I haven't said it on this podcast, but the new version, the new edition of Superman vs Batman, I think it's called Age of Justice or Infinite justice or something. Something that is so much better than the original.

David Brown: 00:40:19

Right.

Angus Henderson: 00:40:19

It's like another 30 minutes longer or an hour longer or something. But.

David Brown: 00:40:24

Right.

Angus Henderson: 00:40:24

Re. Watch it, because it is much better.

David Brown: 00:40:27

Well, it's the same with Lord of the Rings. I mean, the. The director's extended cut is, I think, is better, markedly better than the. Than the.

Angus Henderson: 00:40:35

Tolkien went to my school. His bayonet helmet are in the school library.

David Brown: 00:40:40

All right.

Angus Henderson: 00:40:40

Because I grew up in the Midlands, and the Midlands is where the Twin Towers are. The Twin towers, right. The, you know, Sauron's tower is one end of a reservoir.

David Brown: 00:40:52

Okay.

Angus Henderson: 00:40:52

Birmingham. It's not as impressive as in the film. And, you know, you can see. You can see. You can imagine the Hobbit there or where it used to be.

And there are definitely orcs and trolls walking around the streets of Birmingham as well. So for sure, today. Today they're in tracksuits now. Suits. Some of them are in suits. A lot of them are in tracksuits. A lot of the elves have left.

They all work in the City, in London.

David Brown: 00:41:18

Exactly.

Angus Henderson: 00:41:19

And some of them are in tech, a lot of them are in finance, Some of them are in fintech. But the orcs and the trolls and the dwarves, they're still in Birmingham, wandering the street. I mean, they're lovely. They have their own language.

It's called Yam. Yam. They talk to each other. Yam. Right. Yamu. It's just brilliant. But they're there.

David Brown: 00:41:36

Love it.

Angus Henderson: 00:41:37

So if. Don't go. If you want one of these realistic, you know, immersive film experiences, don't go to the Harry Potter stuff.

Go and walk down Broad street and New street in Birmingham.

David Brown: 00:41:50

You'll get there in Birmingham.

Angus Henderson: 00:41:52

Yeah. Or the Black country, go out into the sticks a bit and you'll start to meet some of the. Some of the hobbits as well.

David Brown: 00:41:58

The hobbits, yeah. Top tip.

Angus Henderson: 00:42:00

They're all still there. Do you know, I saw Martin Freeman. So after the. After.

After we had the Boiling Point screening and premiere in the Prince Charles cinema in Leicester Square, we went to the bar at Soho House and Martin Freeman was standing at the bar next to me. I'd already had a few drinks at this time, so I looked at him and I looked down at his. I looked down at his feet like that. I. I was so invested.

I loved the. My dad read the Lord of the Rings to me when I was a boy and I just fell in love with it. And, yeah, I saw the film, the original films.

I've watched all the films, everything. He's standing there in the bar and I, you know, I'm. I've had two or three these amazingly good free cocktails, Right? Well, free to me.

I mean, I don't know, someone was paying for it. And then I looked down and then he's standing there and I'm like, ah, hello, Martin. Just slipped down. Just. Why did I do.

He's an actor, he's wearing shoes, he's not a hobbit. He doesn't have these big fleshy feet. I expected him to have these big fleshy feet. Drunken me. Cocktail me. Cocktail me.

He'd had an Old Fashioned or a smoky Old Fashioned or something.

David Brown: 00:43:14

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:43:16

A couple of margaritas and a caipirinho. Thought, oh, maybe he's got the. Maybe he's wearing the feet today.

David Brown: 00:43:26

Anyway, you didn't say anything to him about it, did you? You just did.

Angus Henderson: 00:43:31

I think he probably thought, why is this guy who's worked on Boiling Point Looking at my feet. Maybe he's really into shoes. He had some nice brown leather shoes on. He's a lovely guy. Anyway.

David Brown: 00:43:42

Oh, that's too funny. Cool.

Angus Henderson: 00:43:45

This is my world.

David Brown: 00:43:47

Sounds fun.

Angus Henderson: 00:43:51

Yeah.

David Brown: 00:43:51

Oh, yeah. I'll get you back on another time, I think. I think it would be fun.

Angus Henderson: 00:43:55

I'm not sure about that, but maybe we'll have. You haven't seen Succession. I'm. I'm not sure I can come back unless you watch Succession.

David Brown: 00:44:04

All right, maybe that. That'll be. My assignment is to. Is to figure out if we do.

Angus Henderson: 00:44:09

This again, we have to drink the. The drinks that are in the films. So if it's gonna be Bond, we have to. There better be shadow enough to pap. Or something going on.

You know, a little bit of.

David Brown: 00:44:22

I like that.

Angus Henderson: 00:44:24

Something.

David Brown: 00:44:25

I like that. Yeah, we could do. We could do funny. Funny film review.

Angus Henderson: 00:44:29

Yeah.

David Brown: 00:44:30

Type. And then we can. Yeah, drink the. Drink the drinks from the film.

Angus Henderson: 00:44:34

But the audience, if they're watching, if there is any. All six people watching. Exactly. We'll have to drink along with us. That's the rules. And they have to prove it on, like, WhatsApp or Instagram.

David Brown: 00:44:47

Yeah.

Angus Henderson: 00:44:47

Yeah, I like it.

David Brown: 00:44:48

Share your drinks as you're. As you're watching. Yeah, that's cool. I like that.

Angus Henderson: 00:44:52

That's the future here.

David Brown: 00:44:53

They.

Angus Henderson: 00:44:54

It's the future now.

David Brown: 00:44:55

You know, there's a podcast called Drunk Women Solving Crime. It's a couple of ladies. I think there's. I think there's two or three co hosts and then they very frequently have a guest on as well.

But basically, I think the deal is, is that they get on, they start drinking wine and they dive into a case and then they start talking. It's like a true crime thing. And they.

They dig into the case and they start talking about it and then it just gets funnier and funnier as they have more and more wine to Dr. They work through the. As they work through the episode.

Angus Henderson: 00:45:27

So I've started calling Prao or Sparkling ros. Or Rosa. I've started calling it Lady Petrol, so.

David Brown: 00:45:35

Lady Petrol, you know, it just.

Angus Henderson: 00:45:38

We need a little. Little boost. Lady Ladies. That's what they run on. That's what they run on in Tunbridge Wells and Seven Oaks. Yeah, that's what they run on the fuel.

David Brown: 00:45:49

I'm sure it's other places as well.

Angus Henderson: 00:45:51

Yeah.

David Brown: 00:45:52

Awesome. Thanks, man. That was fun.

Angus Henderson: 00:45:55

I've enjoyed myself way more than I ever thought was possible. Talking to you, David. Talking nonsense.

David Brown: 00:46:05

Exactly.

Angus Henderson: 00:46:06

Yeah.

David Brown: 00:46:06

But that's what this is all about. I mean, this whole show is basically. I have all serious client work and shit that I do that I have to be serious.

And we talk about AI and it's all very. The future is bleak and it's going to take everyone's jobs and that kind of thing and how to. And then I'm just like.

I just wanted something where I could just be a bit silly or controversial and just get on and rant about shit. So that's the. That's the idea behind this. So it's perfect. And I think I'm ranting with you. I like.

I like the idea of having a theme, some sort of a drinking theme to go along with it. So maybe that'll be. Maybe that'll be our little shtick that you and I can do. And then we can come on and talk about stuff and. And.

And drink the drinks.

Angus Henderson: 00:46:49

But.

David Brown: 00:46:49

Yeah. Awesome. Thanks, Angus.

Angus Henderson: 00:46:51

Drink the Kool Aid. Well, nice to see you.

David Brown: 00:46:54

Cool. I'll speak to you later.

Bond Theme Song: 00:46:57

When the night falls cold and the silent screams A world of secrets Tears at the seams through the smoke and flame I walk alone A fractured heart carved out of stone the clock is ticking the clock the end is near A whispered promise drowned in fear But I'll rise again where the ashes lay for the game I play won't fade.

Bond Theme Song: 00:47:24

Away on the edge of shadows I stand and fight A ghost in the darkness still in the night when the skies turn red and the truth unwinds I'll face the storm all with the lo in might Let the walls come down Let the thunder come I'll chase.

Bond Theme Song: 00:47:49

The edge Till the heavens fall In a maze of lies the stakes run high the traitors kiss Beneath the crimson sky Every step I take the past ignite A dance with death in the fading light the gun is steady the trigger's mine A fleeting shadow lost in time through the chaos I'll carve my way the hunter's vow won't break today.

Bond Theme Song: 00:48:27

On the edge of shadows I stand in and fire Ghost in the darkness still in the night when the skies turn red and the truth unwinds I'll face the storm with the loaded morning Let the walls come down Let the thunder call I'll chase the edge Till.

Bond Theme Song: 00:48:51

The heavens fall hold your breath the tide will turn in the fire the soul still burns A thousand scars A single name through the ruin I'll stake my claim on the edge of shadows I stand and fight A ghost in the darkness Stealing the night when the skies turn red and the truth unwinds I'll face the storm with the loaded.

Bond Theme Song: 00:49:23

Mind Let the walls come down Let the thunder come I'll ch the edge Till the heavens fall.

Bond Theme Song: 00:49:46

Shadows will never crawl.